I can't help but feel that for all his influence, AKW is a one hit wonder. I never found 8MM all that good .... In fact, I found it surprisingly tame and boring, too much of it Phoenix and Cage watching something off screen and yelping like parodies of dogs.... And by Wolf Man, AKW had lost me.
I also did not find The Killer very interesting, neither as a modern Le Samurai nor a parody of it. People gushing about "Fincher's tight control and attention to detail" seemed like the old paradox about, if you really loved the editing, was it good editing? (As an editor: yeah sometimes). There was one article about how it was really about "Sigma males" that justify all their weaknesses as strengths, which would comport to much of your discussion above, but even so I just don't get the point of it, particularly how after so much killing the protagonist lets off the Big Cheese with... a stern warning. Like fighting his way to Epstein Island just to say, "A-and don't let me catch ya again or you'll be sorry!" Is this purposeful or is AKW literally unable to threaten the executives?
In fact the thing I found funny about The Killer is you don't need to watch it at all. Seriously, the audio tells you the whole story, in a way beyond the rule of thumb that a good audio mix means the image can be turned off: The Killer is far more a podcast than a movie.
This conversation reminds me a lot of the movie Suspect Zero. There's sort of a want to like Suspect Zero outside the scope of Suspect Zero, because it's weird, and because it's made by the weirdo who made classics like Begotten and Shadow of the Vampire (and, personally, because it was shot in New Mexico and features Carrie Anne Moss). But is it weird because it's "good," or "has something to say" or "subverts our expectations"? Not clear. It might just be weird because Merhige believes film is Magick regardless of whether it's good, meaningful, well performed, etc so forth.
God damn, Suspect Zero is such a good comparison, and now I feel like I have to go revisit. All I remember from that movie was an odd aftertaste of "Something wasn't right about this, but it goes beyond my pedestrian sensibilities."
Really good read (and frankly, makes me feel bad for missing out Psycho Killer in the theatre and voting for more AKW movies with my dollars).
I will admit to being a little confused by the insistence on the Satanism of the killer being "wrong": Satanic Bible as a poor line of investigation/metaphor makes sense, but digressing into "this guy is a really bad Satanist; ditto the “Satanic” mass murderers and the “Satanic” rock bands who inspired him" ... perhaps the antagonist ultimately disagrees what is "correct" Satanism? Those Satanic mass murderers did!
Motivation to re-watch with this perspective in mind, though.
Yeah, it's not mentioned in this (excellent) piece, but the Satanic Slasher in the movie very clearly has a beef with other, more performative Satanists. There's an extended sojourn to a Satanist cult mansion (overseen by Malcolm Macdowell!) where the religion being practiced is just an excuse for repeated orgies. Let's just say our slasher was unamused.
I didn't even know this movie existed. But it's nice to see such a spirited discussion about a film that seems to be universally shunned. Reminds of the time I had to defend Speed 2 as a fun movie. Yes, it's nowhere close to the Keanu Reeves film, but hey, it's got Willem Dafoe doing his mad villain thing. Ditto The Karate Kid 2.
Did you also know that Andrew Kevin Walker wrote a script for a planned Batman vs. Superman movie in 2001? Unsurprisingly, it got rejected by Warner Bros. (There is a script draft online but it contains revisions by Akiva Goldsman)
From what I remember (there was a surprisingly candid NY Times piece about it in those days), the WB brass were battling between JJ Abrams Superman script and AKW's Batman/Superman screenplay. And the consensus between everyone was that the Walker script was obviously better and more interesting, but for other reasons (there are always other reasons) they went with Superman, which of course never even got made.
I have read a version of the J.J. Abrams Superman script, and it makes The Rise of Skywalker look like Lawrence of Arabia. In that version, Krypton never exploded but was caught up in a civil war, Supes's cousin comes to Earth and fights Superman Matrix-style, Superman dies and is resurrected in Kryptonian heaven- I think?- when Jor-El gives his life for him, and Lex Luthor turns out to be an alien. Why WB almost went ahead with it, I don't think even the Lord Almighty knows.
As one of the very few who saw Psycho Killer in theaters, I find this discourse riveting - and coming from two of my favorite Substackers, no less.
Alex!!! Yesssss
This is interesting.
I can't help but feel that for all his influence, AKW is a one hit wonder. I never found 8MM all that good .... In fact, I found it surprisingly tame and boring, too much of it Phoenix and Cage watching something off screen and yelping like parodies of dogs.... And by Wolf Man, AKW had lost me.
I also did not find The Killer very interesting, neither as a modern Le Samurai nor a parody of it. People gushing about "Fincher's tight control and attention to detail" seemed like the old paradox about, if you really loved the editing, was it good editing? (As an editor: yeah sometimes). There was one article about how it was really about "Sigma males" that justify all their weaknesses as strengths, which would comport to much of your discussion above, but even so I just don't get the point of it, particularly how after so much killing the protagonist lets off the Big Cheese with... a stern warning. Like fighting his way to Epstein Island just to say, "A-and don't let me catch ya again or you'll be sorry!" Is this purposeful or is AKW literally unable to threaten the executives?
In fact the thing I found funny about The Killer is you don't need to watch it at all. Seriously, the audio tells you the whole story, in a way beyond the rule of thumb that a good audio mix means the image can be turned off: The Killer is far more a podcast than a movie.
This conversation reminds me a lot of the movie Suspect Zero. There's sort of a want to like Suspect Zero outside the scope of Suspect Zero, because it's weird, and because it's made by the weirdo who made classics like Begotten and Shadow of the Vampire (and, personally, because it was shot in New Mexico and features Carrie Anne Moss). But is it weird because it's "good," or "has something to say" or "subverts our expectations"? Not clear. It might just be weird because Merhige believes film is Magick regardless of whether it's good, meaningful, well performed, etc so forth.
Thanks for the dialog. You two are legend.
God damn, Suspect Zero is such a good comparison, and now I feel like I have to go revisit. All I remember from that movie was an odd aftertaste of "Something wasn't right about this, but it goes beyond my pedestrian sensibilities."
Really good read (and frankly, makes me feel bad for missing out Psycho Killer in the theatre and voting for more AKW movies with my dollars).
I will admit to being a little confused by the insistence on the Satanism of the killer being "wrong": Satanic Bible as a poor line of investigation/metaphor makes sense, but digressing into "this guy is a really bad Satanist; ditto the “Satanic” mass murderers and the “Satanic” rock bands who inspired him" ... perhaps the antagonist ultimately disagrees what is "correct" Satanism? Those Satanic mass murderers did!
Motivation to re-watch with this perspective in mind, though.
Yeah, it's not mentioned in this (excellent) piece, but the Satanic Slasher in the movie very clearly has a beef with other, more performative Satanists. There's an extended sojourn to a Satanist cult mansion (overseen by Malcolm Macdowell!) where the religion being practiced is just an excuse for repeated orgies. Let's just say our slasher was unamused.
I didn't even know this movie existed. But it's nice to see such a spirited discussion about a film that seems to be universally shunned. Reminds of the time I had to defend Speed 2 as a fun movie. Yes, it's nowhere close to the Keanu Reeves film, but hey, it's got Willem Dafoe doing his mad villain thing. Ditto The Karate Kid 2.
Did you also know that Andrew Kevin Walker wrote a script for a planned Batman vs. Superman movie in 2001? Unsurprisingly, it got rejected by Warner Bros. (There is a script draft online but it contains revisions by Akiva Goldsman)
From what I remember (there was a surprisingly candid NY Times piece about it in those days), the WB brass were battling between JJ Abrams Superman script and AKW's Batman/Superman screenplay. And the consensus between everyone was that the Walker script was obviously better and more interesting, but for other reasons (there are always other reasons) they went with Superman, which of course never even got made.
I have read a version of the J.J. Abrams Superman script, and it makes The Rise of Skywalker look like Lawrence of Arabia. In that version, Krypton never exploded but was caught up in a civil war, Supes's cousin comes to Earth and fights Superman Matrix-style, Superman dies and is resurrected in Kryptonian heaven- I think?- when Jor-El gives his life for him, and Lex Luthor turns out to be an alien. Why WB almost went ahead with it, I don't think even the Lord Almighty knows.